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Midna
August 9th, 2012, August 9th, 2012, 05:48 PM
Hey guys, just noticed that this section of the forums even existed and thought it would be the perfect place to get some opinions on this topic.

So about a week ago I was hanging out with a friend of mine and we got into a discussion about movies we had been watching recently, I told her that I had recently watched and hated the Twilight series. Unbenounced to me, she is apparently a HUGE fan of those movies (and the books I think too) and proceeded to explain to me how she loved them so much that she actually started writing her own FanFics based on the series. This led us into a debate that I would like to see everyone else's opinions on here: Do you consider fan fiction to be a legitimate form of literature?

Personally, iv never liked writing very much at all so the thought never really appealed to me. But I have to admit, I can definately think of a few movies, books, and tv shows I would love to see more of now that they've ended, and FanFics seem to be the only medium that really keeps any of them going now that their official run is over.
Anyway, just curious about how you all view fan fiction and stuff.

DrGlove
August 9th, 2012, August 9th, 2012, 06:01 PM
Do you consider fan fiction to be a legitimate form of literature?

Why wouldn't it be literature? It's even in the name: fan-fiction. Fiction is certainly literature. It's not published, but that doesn't matter.

If you're asking if it should be appreciated, that's certainly too subjective to get a general feel for all fan-fiction. I really don't give a shit about Twilight, but there is some fan stuff out there that is very interesting to read.

SHOW ME WHAT YOU GOT
August 9th, 2012, August 9th, 2012, 06:08 PM
Why wouldn't it be literature? It's even in the name: fan-fiction. Fiction is certainly literature. It's not published, but that doesn't matter.

If you're asking if it should be appreciated, that's certainly too subjective to get a general feel for all fan-fiction. I really don't give a shit about Twilight, but there is some fan stuff out there that is very interesting to read.

I wish I could thank you for that post.

Fan fiction is still literature. It ranges wildly in quality, but you can still find heartwarming tales in even the strangest of places. Fan fiction is simply fiction that works within the confines of a predetermined setting. That doesn't make it good or bad, it just sets the table for the author! It doesn't make the meal any better or worse.

Now, honestly, I despise Twilight and I refuse to go anywhere near it or its fanfiction, but if it's something that you enjoy then I'm sure there's a fanfic out there you'd like as well. You just need to do a little digging.

Midna
August 9th, 2012, August 9th, 2012, 06:21 PM
I can definately agree with all that, yet you would be surprised to see just how many people make the argument that it is not a legitimate form of literature and that it is little more than someone ripping off an established story. I'm not trying to discredit anyone because of the quality of their writing (again, I can't write to save my life), I was looking more at wheth you guys feel it is a worth-while type of written media; which clearly you do, so it's nice to see that the first two post here just happened to be well thought out AND in agreement.

Not sure how I can define "legitimate literature" better, but my original meaning went back to things you would be able to use to support that your an actual writer. For instance, my brother wrote a some short stories a while back, he went to see someone about getting them published and they asked to see a portfolio of all of his written work. For what he said (based on what other told him, I guess) plenty of people spend huge periods of time writing things like FanFics and npersonal stories, but would never actually include them in a portfolio of their work like that.

DrGlove
August 9th, 2012, August 9th, 2012, 07:38 PM
50 Shades of Gray is practically Twilight fanfic from what I'm told, and that got published, so there's that too.


I wish I could thank you for that post.

:side:

Jaqen_Hghar
August 9th, 2012, August 9th, 2012, 10:33 PM
50 Shades of Gray is practically Twilight fanfic from what I'm told, and that got published, so there's that too.

My curiosity got the best of me again and I went and asked Wikipedia about this... apparently it is exactly a Twilight fanfic... Now, I don't know enough about either Twilight or 50 Shades of Gray to make a real judgement on either of them... but fuck you who ever wrote it, there are so many other things that should have been turned into books, series(es?), and movies before any of this...

...The previous sentence was purely opinion based, please disregard if you disagree with it...

Xemgoa
August 9th, 2012, August 9th, 2012, 10:53 PM
I have to agree Yippee. There is a Fanfic as there is a meal for any taste bud out there. I still concur there are just bad ones, some over exaggerated or satiated, and some that are morally wrong. It's still the writer's choice as it is anyone reading it, to indulge in their work. Fan-fic is literature as well. Alot of good novels even had to start small as hollywood producers had the most embarrassing or very insignificant looking jobs and situations before they hit the big time.

The only way, from my opinion & Point of view, is if it weren't literature; was if it was incoherent, unreadable, poorly put together if a baby slobbering over pieces of turn book pages and put them together thinking he accomplished something readable, that actually wants to spit into the face of literature itself and spite the concept of Literature with all its might. Otherwise even a individual with a bit of a problem in grammar can still broadcast a amazing story.

Sadly my literature is limited to the fact there isn't much books in my house, and a whole lot does not interest me. What forms of Literature, as well as because of my faith to begin with on the first to list, Is my bible. Others include documentaries and little books about canines, their breeds, often where they are raised, and their unique traits people want for their everyday life.

Others include books on mythological creatures, and those fun books that has information and such on Pokemon & Digimon. I like studying on creatures that do or don't exist~ Canines the most since they are my most favorite animal~

If there could ever be a book on all the existing Monster Hunter creatures with a very detailed back story, Details, and ecology on them, I would love that as a book ^^

Chaplin
August 9th, 2012, August 9th, 2012, 11:57 PM
I've never liked them because the authors will usually just put in Mary Sue self-inserts. I've yet to read one that wasn't extremely cringe worthy.

Half-life: Full Life Consequences (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2945837/1/Halflife_Fulllife_Consequences) being the exception ofc.


Half-Life: Full-life Consequences

John Freeman who was Gordon Freemans brother was one day in an office typing on a computer. He got an email from his brother that said that aliens and monsters were attacking his place and aksed him for help so he went.
John Freeman got his computer shut down and wet on the platform to go up to the roof of the building where he left his motorcycle and normal people close because he was in his office lab coat. John Freeman got on his motorcycl and said "its time for me to live up to my family name and face full life consequences" so he had to go.
John Freeman ramped off the building and did a backflip and landed. He kept driving down the road and made sure there was no zombies around because he ddint have weapon.
The contrysides were nice and the plants were singing and the birds and the sun was almost down from the top of the sky. the mood was set for John Freemans quest to help his brother where he was. John Freeman looked around the countrysides and said "its a good day to do what has to be done by me and help my brother to defeat the enemys".
John Freeman was late so he had to drive really fast. A cop car was hiden near by so when John Freeman went by the cops came and wanted to give him a ticket. Here John Freeman saw the first monster because the cop was posessed and had headcrabs.
"I cant give you my lisense officer" John Freeman said
"Why not?" said the headcrab oficer back to John Freeman.
"Because you are headcrab zombie" so John Freeman shot the oficer in the head and drove off thinking "my brother is in trouble there" and went faster.
John Freeman had to go faster like the speed of sound and got there fast because Gordon needed him where he was. John Freeman looked at road signs and saw "Ravenholm" with someons writing under it saying "u shudnt come here" so John Freeman almost turned around but heard screaming like Gordon so he went faster again.
John Freeman drove in and did another flip n jumped off his motorbike and the motor bike took out some headcrab zombies infront of John Freeman. John Freeman smiled and walked fast. John Freeman then looked on the ground and found wepon so he pickd it up and fired fast at zombie goasts in front of a house.
John Freeman said "Zombie goasts leave this place" and the zombie goasts said "but this is our house" and John Freeman felt sorry for them becaus they couldnt live there anymore because they were zombie goasts so he blew up the house and killed the zombie goasts so they were at piece.
Then John Freeman herd another scream from his brother so he kept walking really faster to get where he was. Ravenholdm was nothing like the countrysides there was no birds singing and the pants were dead and teh dirt was messy and bloody from headcrabs.
When John Freeman got to where the screaming was started from he found his brother Gorden Freeman fightin the final bosss and Gordon said "John Freeman! Over here!" so John Freeman went there to where Gordon Freeman was fighting. John Freeman fired his bullet from teh gun really fast and the bullets went and shot the final boss in the eyes and the final boss couldnt see.
Gordon Freeman said "its time to end this ones and for all!" and punched the final boss in the face and the final boss fell. John Freeman said "thanks i could help, bro" and Gordon Freeman said "you should come here earlier next time" and they laughed.
The laughed overed quickly though because John Freeman yelled "LOOK OUT BRO!" and pointed up to the top of the sky. Gordon Freeman looked up and said "NOO! John Freeman run out of here fast as you can!" and John Freeman walked real fast out.
John Freeman loked back and saw Gordon get steppd on by the next boss and he was mad and angry.
"I'll get you back evil boss!" John Freeman yelled at the top of lungs.
to be continued..?


lyk dis if u cry every tiem

Jaqen_Hghar
August 10th, 2012, August 10th, 2012, 12:00 AM
Completely agree with Xem here, it really depends on the individual story and all. I have seen plenty that I would not consider actual stories, nor anything original or well thought out in any way... yet I guarantee you there are people out there who will read it and enjoy it... or at least get off to it in some way...

Anyway, the point remains, yes they should definately be seen as actual literature, but no, their not all worth reading... Hell I write fanfic stuff that I guarantee you I would never include in a portfolio. Not because its dirty or anything, simply because I don't feel its on the same level as what I could do if I really put some time or effort into a story rather than writing it out unplanned and, generally, uneditted. Some people just like to write for the sake of writing... I find it fun, but then I'm weird like that :D

Talespinner_Nerubian
October 24th, 2012, October 24th, 2012, 04:45 AM
Personally don't enjoy fanfics. Humorous ones I'm okay with, I don't really like fan-gasming (couldn't really think of a better word) fan-fiction. And pornographic fanfiction can go fuck itself (it probably already does)

I'm sort of an elitist when it comes to expectations on actual stories. I personally don't think fan-fictions should be considered profitable, but moreso little things people can do when they're bored as such, but for goodness sake, don't make it an actual book. I mean, when I was roleplaying, I wouldn't tolerate cybering and although it took some getting used to the element of other people, I was very serious about it.

Overall, I think fanfics are little things you can read from time to time if you're really, truly bored, but I don't consider them actual literature, as in, they're quality reading material. And when I say "quality", I'm even talking pretty low standards. By definition, they are literature, however. I hate to say it, but from what I can think of a few fanfics, would you consider the scribbles of a toddler worth making a book club over? If yes, then you'd probably also think fanfiction is also real literature.

tl;dr, agree with everybody else on this forum, now clean your room america

Aginor
October 24th, 2012, October 24th, 2012, 10:18 AM
Personally don't enjoy fanfics. Humorous ones I'm okay with, I don't really like fan-gasming (couldn't really think of a better word) fan-fiction. And pornographic fanfiction can go fuck itself (it probably already does)

I'm sort of an elitist when it comes to expectations on actual stories. I personally don't think fan-fictions should be considered profitable, but moreso little things people can do when they're bored as such, but for goodness sake, don't make it an actual book. I mean, when I was roleplaying, I wouldn't tolerate cybering and although it took some getting used to the element of other people, I was very serious about it.

Overall, I think fanfics are little things you can read from time to time if you're really, truly bored, but I don't consider them actual literature, as in, they're quality reading material. And when I say "quality", I'm even talking pretty low standards. By definition, they are literature, however. I hate to say it, but from what I can think of a few fanfics, would you consider the scribbles of a toddler worth making a book club over? If yes, then you'd probably also think fanfiction is also real literature.

tl;dr, agree with everybody else on this forum, now clean your room america

TH-TH-TH-THREAD NECRO

kaiser
October 24th, 2012, October 24th, 2012, 11:17 PM
talespinner, your post saddens me!

the word 'fanfiction' has a LOT of connotation to it. why? because websites like fanfiction.net allow ANYONE to publish works...and that includes 12 year old girls, which means that 90% of what is out there is pure garbage, rife with 'mary-sues' and terrible attempts at grammar.

however, the remaining 10% is full of some of the most well-written, thought provoking, carefully thought out literature that I've ever read. it's a different exercise in a lot of ways - while you are not creating original characters (most of the time), writing excellent fic requires serious effort in the character study department, because you have to take the pre-existing people and universes, apply a situation (read: plot) of your own creation, and ensure that the characters respond and react like themselves, that they stay in character throughout... and when that's done well, it can be absolutely mind-blowing -- certainly actual literature.

it's certainly a wonderful thing in media where there is no more book to be had (harry potter, LOTR, etc). also, for those who love to see their favorite characters thrown into new and/or crazy situations. and if someone wants to see said favorite characters getting it on... more power to them (as long as it's actually well written and not on par with 50 shades)

tl;dr don't judge the idea before you've looked past the 12 year olds!

kaiser
October 24th, 2012, October 24th, 2012, 11:18 PM
wow i didn't realize how old this thread was

...oops

SHOW ME WHAT YOU GOT
October 24th, 2012, October 24th, 2012, 11:31 PM
Personally don't enjoy fanfics. Humorous ones I'm okay with, I don't really like fan-gasming (couldn't really think of a better word) fan-fiction. And pornographic fanfiction can go fuck itself (it probably already does)

I'm sort of an elitist when it comes to expectations on actual stories.

That's not a good thing. It's like being a musical elitist, it just makes you look snobby; like you want to feel superior to other people.


I personally don't think fan-fictions should be considered profitable, but moreso little things people can do when they're bored as such, but for goodness sake, don't make it an actual book. I mean, when I was roleplaying, I wouldn't tolerate cybering and although it took some getting used to the element of other people, I was very serious about it.

It's okay to not like things, but don't be a dick about the things you don't like.


Overall, I think fanfics are little things you can read from time to time if you're really, truly bored, but I don't consider them actual literature, as in, they're quality reading material.And when I say "quality", I'm even talking pretty low standards. By definition, they are literature, however. I hate to say it, but from what I can think of a few fanfics, would you consider the scribbles of a toddler worth making a book club over? If yes, then you'd probably also think fanfiction is also real literature.

That is an incredibly shallow way of thinking about fanfiction. Why would you say that any piece of literature that is made in a setting that isn't the author's own is bad? What if J.R. Martin wrote Harry Potter fanfiction? Would it be bad literature simply because it's not his setting? You could certainly argue that it's bad literature based on the way Martin writes. That makes sense. Throwing it all out because it's "Fan Fiction" is silly.

Talented writers come in all shapes and sizes; good writing comes in all shapes and sizes.

Jaqen_Hghar
October 24th, 2012, October 24th, 2012, 11:37 PM
Well it took a few months but there's a perfect example of what was originally stated in this one. There ARE plenty of people who would agree with Talespinner on this one. Personally I don't see where their coming from with that opinion, but they are certainly entitled to it. Frankly it seems like its more their loss than anything else, plenty of FanFics are genuinely good..... The bad ones tend to get more publicity though it would seem...

Talespinner_Nerubian
October 26th, 2012, October 26th, 2012, 07:43 PM
[/B]

That's not a good thing. It's like being a musical elitist, it just makes you look snobby; like you want to feel superior to other people.



It's okay to not like things, but don't be a dick about the things you don't like.



That is an incredibly shallow way of thinking about fanfiction. Why would you say that any piece of literature that is made in a setting that isn't the author's own is bad? What if J.R. Martin wrote Harry Potter fanfiction? Would it be bad literature simply because it's not his setting? You could certainly argue that it's bad literature based on the way Martin writes. That makes sense. Throwing it all out because it's "Fan Fiction" is silly.

Talented writers come in all shapes and sizes; good writing comes in all shapes and sizes.

Yes, I am an elitist writing snob and a snob when it comes to most forms of music today.

Another really big part of what I don't like about fanfics is that they may not know everything about the setting as the author imagined. Of course, you can still write it good in another way, but if you don't know all the secrets about it, then it seems somewhat lacking. Also, every writer has their unique styles, and fanfics really lack half of what people like about the stories, which is the style of the writer. Finally, relating back to my first point, if a lot of things are left up to the reader to guess, it's impossible to make an accurate fanfic. That'd be trying to make a sequel to the Binding of Isaac. It's impossible to do at all, as so many things are left up to interpretation and only the creator knows right.

Aginor
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 03:50 PM
Yes, I am an elitist writing snob and a snob when it comes to most forms of music today.

Another really big part of what I don't like about fanfics is that they may not know everything about the setting as the author imagined. Of course, you can still write it good in another way, but if you don't know all the secrets about it, then it seems somewhat lacking.

Yeah. That's why it's called fanfiction.


Also, every writer has their unique styles, and fanfics really lack half of what people like about the stories, which is the style of the writer. Finally, relating back to my first point, if a lot of things are left up to the reader to guess, it's impossible to make an accurate fanfic.

Yeah. That's why it's called fanfiction.



Finally, relating back to my first point, if a lot of things are left up to the reader to guess, it's impossible to make an accurate fanfic.

Yeah. That's why it's called fanfiction. I'm not going to go read "The Lusty and Big Bosomed Pikachu" and think "WELL SHIT, THIS ISN'T ACCURATE AT ALL. THIS IS PREPOSTEROUS.

Talespinner_Nerubian
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 06:04 PM
"The Lusty and Big Bosomed Pikachu" sounds like something that would haunt my waking life. Mayhaps I even glimpse upon thine tome, thy wouldst perish.

Doctor
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 06:27 PM
Fanfiction != cannon. Once you understand and accept that, the entire 'genre' becomes easier to stomach. There are a number of fanfics that I've read that were great, even if they weren't even an attempt at following the established storyline.

booper_101
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 06:47 PM
I think that fanfictions are a great way for people to elaborate on something that you like. I think fanfictions are a good way to use your creativity and are definitely an actual form of literature. I've heard of many great fanfictions that are good to read and became quite popular. As others have stated Talespinner, don't judge it just because you haven't found the good ones <3

Talespinner_Nerubian
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 08:50 PM
I'd rather not dig through a pile of shit to find a single kernel of corn.

Doctor
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 09:39 PM
I'd rather not dig through a pile of shit to find a single kernel of corn.

Then talk to people who know of good fanfics (Gee, there can't possibly be a whole thread of people on this very forum who might, could there?) and get recommendations from them, instead of assume everything is shit because you've never found one you enjoyed.

Talespinner_Nerubian
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 10:25 PM
I still highly doubt I would like those recommended to me.

Doctor
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 10:42 PM
I still highly doubt I would like those recommended to me.

There's no winning with you, is there?

You've firmly established you don't like/won't like fanfics. You're free to leave the thread anytime you'd like.

SHOW ME WHAT YOU GOT
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 11:17 PM
I still highly doubt I would like those recommended to me.

I don't get it. You're operating under the assumption that it is impossible for someone to write a piece of literature that is decent unless it's an original piece. Why? Do you think a talented author suddenly loses their ability to write when they're not inside of a setting that is entirely their own? Where does that come from?

Talespinner_Nerubian
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 11:47 PM
@Yippie


Yes, I am an elitist writing snob and a snob when it comes to most forms of music today.

Another really big part of what I don't like about fanfics is that they may not know everything about the setting as the author imagined. Of course, you can still write it good in another way, but if you don't know all the secrets about it, then it seems somewhat lacking. Also, every writer has their unique styles, and fanfics really lack half of what people like about the stories, which is the style of the writer. Finally, relating back to my first point, if a lot of things are left up to the reader to guess, it's impossible to make an accurate fanfic. That'd be trying to make a sequel to the Binding of Isaac. It's impossible to do at all, as so many things are left up to interpretation and only the creator knows right.

Also, I find nonfiction writing to be, at the lowest of the low, adequate.

SHOW ME WHAT YOU GOT
October 27th, 2012, October 27th, 2012, 11:56 PM
Yes, I am an elitist writing snob and a snob when it comes to most forms of music today.

Pls leave

pls

Talespinner_Nerubian
October 28th, 2012, October 28th, 2012, 12:19 AM
7182

Jaqen_Hghar
October 28th, 2012, October 28th, 2012, 03:07 AM
Nothing personal Talespinner, but your doing no favors for your case by acting so immature about this. This has literally become the equivalent of someone who has convinced themselves they don't like a food they have never tried. You made your point, stated your beliefs, and found an entire thread full of people who believe something different... Why not just drop the subject and move onto a different thread?

More on the topic however, seeing as we have had such a fine turnout of people defending the genre, what sorts of stories have you guys read/wrote in this department? I would love some suggestions for good fics that might be worth reading through during... say.... Five hours stuck behind a photo counter....

Talespinner_Nerubian
October 28th, 2012, October 28th, 2012, 03:22 AM
Nothing personal Talespinner, but your doing no favors for your case by acting so immature about this. This has literally become the equivalent of someone who has convinced themselves they don't like a food they have never tried. You made your point, stated your beliefs, and found an entire thread full of people who believe something different... Why not just drop the subject and move onto a different thread?

Some people didn't understand what my opinion truly was on it, and I indeed may have gotten carried away, but I'll leave the topic be as it's switching now.

Aginor
November 3rd, 2012, November 3rd, 2012, 12:09 PM
@Yippie



Also, I find nonfiction writing to be, at the lowest of the low, adequate.


I'd forgotten about this thread, and then I saw this.

I hope you're happy with yourself, you made me kick my computer over.

SHOW ME WHAT YOU GOT
November 3rd, 2012, November 3rd, 2012, 12:21 PM
I'd forgotten about this thread, and then I saw this.

I hope you're happy with yourself, you made me kick my computer over.

Please Aginor, I beg you from the bottom of my cold, dead heart, don't get him started again. I don't think I could stop myself from throwing my monitor out the window.

Talespinner_Nerubian
November 3rd, 2012, November 3rd, 2012, 10:49 PM
7334